Like many bloggers, I appreciate comments from readers. I try to make it a habit to not actually engage in debate in the comments section although I’ve given that a go here and there. Some of the comments, however, demand a response and some of the more egregious ones demand a response that rises to the level of their very own post here at HoodaThunk? Case in point is this comment left by user “Bob Smith” on my post regarding Sheriff Simpson’s signing on to the ICE 287(g) program a couple of weeks ago. The comment is a real beauty and deserves to be pointed out directly. And then to have the glaring fallacies put into the spotlight for all to see. Ladies & gentlemen, here’s Bob:
Should we deal with the problem by allowing law enforcement to engage in national origin profiling? No because we would be asking them to break the law. She we allow them to conduct illegal search and seizures, no this is in violation of the US Constitution. A person walking down the street should not be subject to law enforcement scrutiny because of their national origin, dress style (other than blatant gang-wear), and even then that is questionable. So if it is impossible to deport all of the un-authorized person’s living in this country, what happens when they cannot find legitimate employment? They participate in criminal activity such as gangs. Furthermore, rather than worsening the problems by deporting the illegal-immigrant parents, of legal us born children and disrupting homes, we need to come up with a better way. Your government has failed you on protecting the borders. As a result these immigrants are apart of the fabric of this country.
I propose the following:
1. The government deports any illegal-immigrant convicted of any felony, or any crime of turpitude.
2. Any illegal-immigrant who was convicted of any felony or any crime of turpitude in their respective country should be deported.
3. Any illegal-immigrant participating in a criminal enterprise or gang should be deported.
4. Any illegal immigrant who is in this county and has never been convicted of a felony or any crime of turpitude, in this country or abroad, who is presently working a job that would be considered legal if worked by a person who is authorized to work in the United States is granted legal status to work in this country.
They are here, they will always be here, and there is nothing that you anti-immigrant people can do about it. Total deportation is not the answers and it is impossible. You better be smart in your solution to combat it. You don’t want to make the problem worse.
Comment by Bob Smith | 27 June, 2008
Let’s have a look from the top, shall we? Where in the law is national profiling illegal? Racial profiling is certainly cast as a very dark evil but putting people from different nations through different levels of inspection has long been an accepted practice. When’s the last time you heard of someone required to undergo more stringent medical records checks or offer proof of innoculations when they entered the US from Ireland? Care to make the same observation about arrivals from certain parts of Africa? You’ll find there’s a certain difference in how those issues are handled dependant on from where the arrival comes in. I am also not entirely convinced that racial profiling for immigrations purposes is necessarily illegal. Our policies and procedures disallow it, but I would very much like to see the law making it a crime cited. Care to step up, Bob?
Then there’s the rhetoric about 4th Amendment, asking if we should all vote to allow the government to suspend it. Who’s making that suggestion, really? Is anyone making that suggestion, outside of allegations cast by overheated open-borders folks?
From those 2 assertions, Bob concludes that deporting all un-authorized persons living in this country is impossible. I don’t for a second concede such a thing. Simply because we’re not going to allow police to randomly search anyone on the street or send every person even remotely exhibiting latino characteristics to deportation proceedings doesn’t mean that we can’t deport people who are here illegally. There are other ways to detect such people, not the least of which is in the process of verifying job applicants and verifying eligibility for accessing publicly-funded services. It most certainly can be done, it just hasn’t been and isn’t being. It’s not a matter of being impossible, it’s a function of the lack of will. It’s not that we can’t, it’s that we don’t and won’t. Not yet, in any case.
Slipping right from this notion that we can’t deport all the unauthorized people, he makes the conclusion that anyone who “can’t find legitimate employment” will end up in gangs. Again, not necessarily. Many of them can and do wind up on welfare rolls, drawing a check on the taxpayer.
And, lastly (at least in his opening paragraph) we get that conflation of deporting any illegal with the deportation of illegal alien parents away from US-born kids. Then comes the crack about “Your government has failed you…” and the assertion that these illegals are a part of “the fabric of this country.” No one who has been serious about this issue hasn’t recognized that the situation of illegal alien parents and their US-born children represents real problems for all of us - Americans, illegals, and the kids alike. We do need to determine what we’re going to do about it but that’s not going to happen for so long as people like Bob, here, continue to use these kids as a cheap talking-point to suggest that we should simply ignore the crime these illegals have committed: illegally entering our county in violation of our immigrations laws. In all of these kinds of so-called arguments, the people who want to toss these kids’ unfortunate situation into the faces of we who support enforcement of our laws never seem to want to face the reality that illegal immigrants are illegal because they broke the law. They just want us to ignore it, give it a pass. Anything but actually address it. So long as that continues, this issue isn’t getting fixed.
Last I checked, Bob, the government of the United States is your government, too, so don’t throw that little bit of dross around to heavily. You need look no further than this blog to see my feelings on the government’s horrible record at securing our borders, so don’t think that little bit of theater is going to gain you much with me. Oh, and I don’t see where I have to concede so much as an inch on the matter of whether people who cheerfully busted our laws are to be considered part of this nation’s fabric. I’ll save that designation for the people who are here legally, thank you.
His proposals are just fine, right down to #4. It cracks me up, however, that he included “crime[s] of turpitude” in his list. Look it up and you’ll find some interesting issues about what comprises such a crime and what doesn’t. Public drunkness, even repeatedly, is a misdemeanor. Getting caught having sex at 2:00 am in the public park with one’s wife is charged as a crime of turpitude, assuming the cop in question feels like making an issue of it. In Bob’s proposal, the illegal busted 10 times for falling down drunk in the same park gets a pass. The illegal and his wife on the other hand get deported. That’s fair?
Coming here illegally is a crime. That’s why it’s called illegal. If someone is caught, by whatever method we use, being here illegally, that person should be deported, barring some serious circumstances. That is not, as I’ve said, anti-immigrant. Bob makes the typical open-borders argument that anyone who wants illegals deported is anti-immigrant, and that’s just crap. It puts the gang-banger who snuck over the border in the dead of night in the same category as the lawful immigrant who has dilligently obeyed our laws - all of our laws. That’s not right and I’ll never agree to it. All the name-calling and ad hominen attacks in the world - Bob’s included - don’t add up to persuasive argumentation and proposals that are based on them aren’t real solutions. They’re just laziness and arrogance gussied up to look like compassion.